Article: 7186 of rec.games.frp.dnd Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd Path: email!mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at!alex From: alex@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Alexander Forst) Subject: Invisibility/Magic and physics Message-ID: <1992Dec9.160508.15119@email.tuwien.ac.at> Keywords: invisibility, magic Sender: news@email.tuwien.ac.at Nntp-Posting-Host: mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at Organization: Technical University of Vienna Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1992 16:05:08 GMT Lines: 100 A few years ago I started a campaign with a group of students (physics, astronomy, mathematics). They were very interested in the way how magic "really" works. So we tried to explain certain spell effects with the help of quantum mechanics and so on. The way magic works (at least in my campaign): As you all know, :), there is the positive and negative material plane. Of course there is an energy flow between them. When a magic-user casts a spell he is channeling and transforming this energy flow. The actual casting of the spell triggers a certain amount of this energy which can then be used for the effect. If you use a material component, then you are adding more energy to the spell. Because there is so much energy there (remember E = mc^2) nearly every spell effect is possible. *** please note: Priest spells do *not* work that way!!! They depend on the existence of gods who actually perform the spell, i.e., from 1st to 3rd spellevel the minions of the gods do it, 4th and 5th level lesser gods who work for the actual god, and 6th and 7th level spells the actual god personally creates the spell effect. *** another note: The magic-user spell "wish" is very, very special!!! You need some "meta-energy" to do the spell effect. Imagine what "I wish for more wishes" and "I wish that my wish is not granted" would do without a meta-energy. (see: Goedel, Escher, Bach; D. Hofstadter) *** 2nd note on priest spells: I do *not* like the idea of priest spells being transformed to magic-user spells, like "know alignment" This spoils (in my opinion) the playability of priests. Remember priest act as the link between mankind and gods! Not every little mage should gain access to the same spells. Okay, now for a few spells: Light This is an easy one. The mage uses the energy flow to make the atoms at a given location emit photons. Note that this location could be an actual object or the light just comes from the air. => you can't create light in vacuum, cause you need atoms to do it. Continual light The 2nd level spell is mightier (our mage can control the energy better) and we have enough energy for photons left (E=mc^2). Invisibility When you use this spell, photons are not absorbed nor reflected by your body. They are going right thru all material. So it is *not* possible for you to see yourself. Important!!! Only visible wavelengths are affected. You don't want this spell to be a protection from heat or cold, i.e., the infrared spectrum. Second, this means that if you use real infravision, you could actually see an invisible person in total darkness. (You see, it's very tricky) Fireball Lightning Bolt trivial, just take energy, and booom. Levitation Fly Jump Push Atoms and molecules are pushing you forward. Darkness This is a tricky one. Say, darkness does not allow photons to be emitted. Remember the wavelengths of the electromagnetic waves. If you prohibit *any* radiation, then also heat (from a fire) and ultraviolet light is blocked (never get sunburns). Infravision again: you don't want someone with IV see in magical darkness -> no infrared spectrum. My group of characters started to burn a small hut and the Priestress of Darkness casted a globe of darkness right in the middle of the hut. It *is* then possible to enter the hut stay uninjured!! You see it is not that easy because you must be very specific about how and why a spell is working this and that way. On the other hand it is a great advantage because now you can use spells in very, very different ways and you know *why* they work that way. I would like your opinion on that, hope you like it. My group was enthusiastic (ya know, physicians) P.S.: If you don't know how to explain a given spells, well, it's magic! -- Alexander Forst alex@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at "Dad! You shot the Flanders-Zombie!" Fax: *43 1 505 78 38 "He was a Zombie?" Bart & Homer Simpson Article: 7193 of rec.games.frp.dnd Path: email!news.univie.ac.at!hp4at!mcsun!uunet!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!usc!news.service.uci.edu!proclus.ss.uci.edu!jkim From: jkim@proclus.ss.uci.edu (Jin Kim) Subject: Re: Invisibility/Magic and physics Nntp-Posting-Host: proclus.ss.uci.edu Message-ID: <2B26364F.25596@news.service.uci.edu> Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd Organization: University of California, Irvine Keywords: invisibility, magic Lines: 29 References: <1992Dec9.160508.15119@email.tuwien.ac.at> Date: 9 Dec 92 18:09:19 GMT In article <1992Dec9.160508.15119@email.tuwien.ac.at>, alex@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Alexander Forst) writes: |> A few years ago I started a campaign with a group of students (physics, |> astronomy, mathematics). They were very interested in the way how magic |> "really" works. So we tried to explain certain spell effects with the help |> of quantum mechanics and so on. |> |> The way magic works (at least in my campaign): |> |> |> Invisibility |> When you use this spell, photons are not absorbed nor reflected by your |> body. They are going right thru all material. So it is *not* possible |> for you to see yourself. |> Important!!! Only visible wavelengths are affected. You don't want |> this spell to be a protection from heat or cold, i.e., the infrared |> spectrum. Second, this means that if you use real infravision, you |> could actually see an invisible person in total darkness. This means that the invisible person can't see either. If all the photons are unaffected, then none get absorbed by the cones and rods in your eyes. Even if the cones and rods absorb the light, you would have a terrible time seeing because your cones and rods do not know the direction of light. In normal eyes, there is very little reflection in the eye so the cones and rods 'know' which direction they are looking. Jin Kim Currently a Cavalier wishing he were a Paladin Article: 7348 of rec.games.frp.dnd Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd Path: email!news.univie.ac.at!paladin.american.edu!europa.asd.contel.com!howland.reston.ans.net!wupost!sdd.hp.com!ux1.cso.uiuc.edu!news.cso.uiuc.edu!uxa.cso.uiuc.edu!tgt33358 From: tgt33358@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Thanatos) Subject: Re: Invisibility/Magic and physics References: <1992Dec9.160508.15119@email.tuwien.ac.at> <1992Dec12.152804.797@ualr.edu> Message-ID: Sender: usenet@news.cso.uiuc.edu (Net Noise owner) Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 22:37:23 GMT Lines: 35 >In article <1992Dec9.160508.15119@email.tuwien.ac.at>, alex@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Alexander Forst) writes: >A few years ago I started a campaign with a group of students (physics, >astronomy, mathematics). They were very interested in the way how magic >"really" works. So we tried to explain certain spell effects with the help >of quantum mechanics and so on. > >The way magic works (at least in my campaign): > >As you all know, :), there is the positive and negative material plane. >Of course there is an energy flow between them. When a magic-user casts >a spell he is channeling and transforming this energy flow. The actual >casting of the spell triggers a certain amount of this energy which can >then be used for the effect. If you use a material component, then you >are adding more energy to the spell. >Because there is so much energy there (remember E = mc^2) nearly every >spell effect is possible. Well, this is all well and good, but IMO, the BEST explaination of the nature of magick is in the Ars Magica game, and the background is easily adaptable. Put simply, reality is directly influenced by human perceptions. Thus, quantum mechanics weren't installed until someone thought of them as a more efficient system. The Ars Magica universe runs on Aristotelian physics, and out Physics major winces every time one of us Liberal Arts types think of a way to weasel out of physics. A LOT of fun. "Shouldn't you be falling?" "Nope. I never learned the Law of Gravity." - Bugs Bunny -- I don't mind being the smartest / Thanatos, DeathUrge, Master of Unknown man in the world...I just wish it \ Time and Space tgt33358@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu wasn't this one... / It's a Zen thing... -Ozymandias \ you wouldn't understand...